Montgomery County Democratic Party launch smear site

Considering the Montgomery County Democratic Party can barely manage their own site (go look at the greek text placeholder under candidates)  it comes as a surprise that they’ve launched “No Gary No” to run a smear against independent mayoral challenger, Gary Leitzell:

Copyright 2009. All Rights Reserved.

Paid for by the Montgomery County Democratic Party.

Not authorized by any candidate or candidate’s committee.

via No Gary No!.

Checking GoDaddy:

Registrant:
Montgomery County Democratic Party

131 South Wilkinson Street
Dayton, Ohio 45402
United States

Registered through: GoDaddy.com, Inc. (http://www.godaddy.com)
Domain Name: NOGARYNO.COM
Created on: 06-Aug-09
Expires on: 06-Aug-10
Last Updated on: 06-Aug-09

Administrative Contact:
Klco, Daniel [email protected]
Montgomery County Democratic Party
131 South Wilkinson Street
Dayton, Ohio 45402
United States
(937) 222-4007

And sadly, they are using WordPress, just like this site- but they don’t know what a category is.

There is no reason for this kind of party intervention. If Rhine McLin has a problem with Gary- she needs to say it herself. It’s too bad we have so many “forums” and never any debates. The art of politics has left the building.

Now we just have soundbites and sod-slinging. Thanks, Montgomery County Dems, this is why I can’t be a “proud” member of your private political country club.

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28 Responses

  1. Teresa Lea September 22, 2009 / 9:55 am
    They don’t let you leave comments either.
    What a joke.

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  2. Hall September 22, 2009 / 10:17 am
    At one point, there was something between Gary and Rhine about ‘no negative campaigning’ that they both agreed to. She can certainly agree to that knowing others will do it for her.
     
    Gary needs to point out and say “I won’t stoop to that level. I will tell you what I plan to do, not what others didn’t do…”. Negative campaigning is a sure-fire way to lose my support, no matter who does it.

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  3. Valerie September 22, 2009 / 10:42 am
    There’s a place to add comments at the bottom of the page.

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  4. David Esrati September 22, 2009 / 11:12 am

    @Valerie- at least 2 people have tried to comment on the smear site- it won’t accept input.

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  5. Lynn September 22, 2009 / 11:18 am
    Interesting. I was wondering if someone will start a vote no on Esrati site. Then I realized there is already an anti-Esrati site. It’s called http://www.esrati.com. A site where an angry man rambles on and says things that would get any candidate voted down. Where he fights with undecided voters and arrogantly tells them “just read these one thousand posts” to figure out what he is for. Then he posts an indecipherable “plan” that has no clear ideas for anyone to get behind. Way to appeal to 2% of the electorate. Larkin is right about that.

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  6. David Lauri September 22, 2009 / 3:12 pm
    Hell, I’ve got a better anti-Gary Leitzell site than they do, and I wasn’t even trying:
    http://www.davidlauri.com/blog/tag-Gary%20Leitzell
     
    And if Gary would simply admit that he was wrong and hypocritical about traditional marriage and promise to oppose any attempts to remove sexual orientation and gender identity from Dayton’s non-discrimination ordinance, my comments would be dated and irrelevant.

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  7. Gene September 22, 2009 / 5:59 pm
    What is the big deal with Gary? This is a bit confusing? He said what, when, to whom?

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  8. Thomas Kohn September 22, 2009 / 6:19 pm
    The Montgomery County Democratic Party site is a single-page “presence” with no active links. Looks like the Dems need to find a good web developer before they go live.

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  9. Jeff September 22, 2009 / 7:51 pm
    And if Gary would simply admit that he was wrong and hypocritical about traditional marriage and promise to oppose any attempts to remove sexual orientation and gender identity from Dayton’s non-discrimination ordinance, my comments would be dated and irrelevant.
     
     
    You did a good job, David L, on flushing out Leitzell on the gay rights issue (or trying too).  I was wondering where he stood.  Funny to think my GOP state rep out here in sububria is to the left of Leitzell on this, actually taking a stand for civil rights protections for lesbians and gays.  Too bad Leitzell can’t bring himself to do that.  Though, to be fair, neither could Joey Williams.

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  10. Gary Leitzell September 22, 2009 / 9:21 pm
    Mr. Lauri, your comments are dated and irrelevant. I’m not opposed. If you would ever go back to that original email that I sent you, you will see that I never mentioned anything about “Traditional marriage”.  My statement was “traditional word, like marriage” but you went off on a tangent and wouldn’t allow comments to your site.

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  11. David Lauri September 23, 2009 / 9:26 am
    ‘Twasn’t me who went off on a tangent.  I asked about the non-dsicrimination ordinance, not marriage, which is not a local issue, and you felt the need to sound off on marriage, saying, unasked, “I do have a problem with changing the legal definition of a traditional word like marriage to line the pockets of lawyers though.”
     
    It used to be, legally, that married women had to take their husband’s surname.  You don’t have any problem with your wife’s having a different last name, so you obviously didn’t care about that traditional legal aspect of marriage.  And you certainly don’t care about many non-legal traditional aspects of marriage.  Not that it’s a bad thing — I think it’s great that you’re able to work from home and take an active role in raising your daughter — but you do not have a traditional marriage.
     
    So, since you brought up the topic of marriage when I asked you about Dayton’s non-discrimination ordinance, and since David E’s site, unlike mine, does allow for comments, feel free to comment.  What does “I do have a problem with changing the legal definition of a traditional word like marriage to line the pockets of lawyers though” mean?  Do you think that allowing two men or two woment to marry will harm our society, and if so how?
     
    And, by the way, “I’m not opposed” is not the same thing as a clear statement such as “I would be opposed to any attempts to remove sexual orientation and gender identity from Dayton’s non-discrimination ordinance.”

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  12. Gene September 23, 2009 / 9:45 am
    Zip it on the traditional marriage. Most people do not have a traditional marriage according to your definition. It used to be acceptable to beat woman, keep them at home, make them cook and clean, not letting them vote or have a job. We have evolved.

    Where does (did) it say, legally, that woman had to take the last name? In every state? USA? England? France? China? Where are you talking about?

    Tradition varies from place to place. Thanks for the blanket statement. Typical Liberal Redchief (you know, the leader of the losing Reds………..)

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  13. Hall September 23, 2009 / 10:03 am
    @David Lauri: Allow comments at your site related to the ‘topics’ you make up. Problem solved.

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  14. An Observer September 23, 2009 / 11:52 am
    @ David Esrati: make that three. Wouldn’t work for me either despite many attempts. I would be suspicious that it’s deliberate if the rest of the site (both layout and content) weren’t so laughably bad.

    I guess that’s the nature of the attack game, though…not offering any real alternatives or solutions, just mouthing off.

    Also, that’s Latin, not Greek. Just sayin’.

    @ David Lauri: are you really going to try to torpedo quite possibly the last chance Dayton has on an issue that is mainly being fought at the state and federal levels?

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  15. David Lauri September 23, 2009 / 3:38 pm
    It wasn’t I who brought up the issue of marriage.  It was Gary Leitzell.  I simply wanted to know whether he’d oppose any attempts to remove sexual orientation from Dayton’s non-discrimination ordinance.  On 12/27/2008 I sent him an e-mail with the subject, “What’s your position on Dayton’s non-discrimination ordinance,” and with one line in the body, “Specifically, did you support the addition to it of sexual orientation as a protected class?”  I did not ask him about marriage.  He felt compelled for some reason to comment on marriage.

    As for where it legally said that women were required to take their husbands’ surname upon marriage, look at page 34 of this research paper and the sources it cites: http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1351133  (Click the download link on that page to open the paper in PDF format)
     
    In particular, Chapman v. Phoenix Nat’l Bank, 85 N.Y. 437, 449 (N.Y. 1881) (“[A woman’s] maiden surname is absolutely lost, and she ceases to be known thereby”).
     
    As for trying to torpedo Gary Leitzell’s chances, I never set out to do that.  If he’d simply answered my original e-mail with something like, “I supported the extension of Dayton’s non-discrimination ordinance to include sexual orientation” or “I oppose any attempts to change Dayton’s non-discrimination ordinance as it now stands,” I’d have had no complaint.  Instead he said that marriage is a traditional word whose definition it would be dangerous to change.  As you can see from his own life, he doesn’t mind having the tradition updated when it comes to his own marriage.
     
    As for allowing comments on my site, I choose not to allow comments on my website, and if you don’t like it, there’s not thing one you can do about it except to comment on other forums about how you disagree with that decision.

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  16. T October 13, 2009 / 8:48 am
    I attended a neighborhood meeting last night and got to see who Mr. Leitzell presents himself as up close and personal. Unfortunately, I went into that meeting determined to support anyone but Mayor McGlin and came out seeing no alternative.

    If demeanor is any measure of the openness we can expect a challenging candidate to display once in office, than, regardless of what the Democratic Party or the current Mayor has said about him, I expect that Mr. Leitzell would follow his own, personal, agenda, regardless of the communication coming from his constituents. When mildly challenged on a single issue (BSL – Breed Specific Legislation), his response was defensive and short and his body language was to walk away while continuing to interrupt (talking over his shoulder) and repeat himself.

    Animal welfare activists and supporters need to beware of Mr. Leitzell. While he did not quite go so far as to state his support of BSL, he proudly held up his experience in the insurance industry and backed Ohio’s definition of “Pit Bulls” as vicious dogs. In other words, if, in the eyes of the state of Ohio, you “own” a dog they define as a “Pit Bull”, Mr. Leitzell will have you buying $100,000 in insurance and chaining your dog when outside.

    His stance on removing the “sexual orientation” and “gender identity” language is still unclear to me, even after reading his response. Setting aside anyone’s definition of “traditional marriage”, will he support an attempt to remove that language, should the political opportunity present itself?

    While I understand that opposing candidates need to set themselves apart, Mr. Leitzell appeared arrogant in his presentation, and a personal encounter with him after the meeting seemed to confirm that impression. As someone who spends a great deal of time, emotional energy, and financial resources rescuing the neglected, abused, and abandoned dogs and cats in this city, my primary concern for Dayton is the welfare of those animals and the ability of myself and others who volunteer to help them. No one who rescues animal wants Gary Leitzell in office, and I, for one, am already in the process of letting them all know. (Next time a constituent tells you, “I was disturbed by your response to . . .” anything, I suggest you paint on your best listening face, suck it up, and act like a politician who cares about what that voter thinks, Mr. Leitzell. There is enough arrogance in politics. You are not the answer to the Rhine McGlin problem.)

    May the Force find you and help you make the world a better place today.

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  17. David Esrati October 13, 2009 / 10:36 am

    @T

    Single issue voting is a very dangerous path. Do I vote for Mussolini because he made the trains run on time? There is a lot more to this race than viscous dog ordinances and sexual orientation.

    Do I believe that the breed specific laws are good solutions- of course not. Defining a breed is in the eye of the beholder. Do I believe that dogs that bite, or show overly aggressive behavior shouldn’t be bonded, or the owners held responsible- absolutely.

    There are some “punting dogs” like chihuahuas that are very likely to bite- however, no one is going to die from the little critters. The people who have these overly aggressive dogs are just as dangerous as the dogs- and maybe, we need to place breed restrictions based on your criminal record? (just an idea- for discussion).

    However, to place dogs rights before peoples needs in this city is very shortsighted. Gary may not be perfect, but, at least he’s not taking huge donations from questionable sources. That alone should be a better indication of worthiness of your vote.

    Thank you for your input on the site- and for asking a question that hasn’t been asked before.

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  18. Tim S. October 13, 2009 / 10:57 am
    my primary concern for Dayton is the welfare of those animals and the ability of myself and others who volunteer to help them.–T

    @T–What about the humans?

    However, to place dogs rights before peoples needs in this city is very shortsighted.–DE

    @David Esrati– Thank you for a sensible reply.

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  19. David Lauri October 13, 2009 / 12:27 pm
    There is a lot more to this race than viscous dog ordinances and sexual orientation.
     
    There is indeed.  However, one can learn something about Mr. Leitzell from his responses to these two issues.  He wasn’t politically savvy enough not to bring up marriage equality when it’s not a local issue and when his own life experiences show him to be a hypocrite on the issue.  I didn’t witness the exchange between him and T, but from T’s side of things, it also doesn’t seem Mr. Leitzell was very savvy in dealing in person with someone with whom he disagrees.

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  20. T October 13, 2009 / 3:19 pm
    Thank you for your thoughtful comments. On a state or national level, I do not vote on single issues. My loyalty to the city of Dayton, however, is nil. Let me tell you why . . . I go to Yellow Springs and feel like I’m in a different world, because people actually welcome being approached and engaged in conversation. In Dayton, the demeanor of the average (i.e., random) person walking down the street is defensive. In Yellow Springs, people look at a “Pit Bull” like it is any other dog, almost without exception. In Dayton, there is often fear in the eyes of the beholder. Why? Because people in Dayton are afraid of their own shadows. They have been, for a long time, because the city has been economically depressed for 3 decades now, and things have only gotten worse.

    Why don’t I fight for or concern myself with the humans here, you ask. Humans are capable of gaining their own resources. Canines and felines, animals we have domesticated and therefore (should) assume responsibility for, can do nothing to work their way out of situations of abuse and neglect. They depend entirely on the help of responsible and compassionate humans. If you have not been exposed to the dog rescue world, please get some experience before drawing conclusions. The commercials you see on television are not exaggerated, and those stories play out every single day right here in innocent little Dayton.

    Now, let me answer the obvious question that is certain to come flying back: Why don’t I move to Yellow Springs (or any place else), if I detest Dayton so much? Economics is my only obstacle.

    Lastly, to be entirely clear, I am not saying that there are no decent, interesting, intelligent, creative, awesome people living in Dayton. There certainly are, and I am thankful for them everyday, but progressive-minded intellectuals are needles in the Dayton haystack. Gary Leitzell is not, by the way, among them. His arrogance and inability to respond with consideration to a question that was presented in a respectful manner and which was perfectly relevant are reason enough for me to take him off the list of viable candidates. Sadly, that leaves only the woman you tell me is accepting money from questionable sources. What is a voter to do with this quandry? Vote for no one or write someone who is unwilling to accept the responsibility in?

    (Yes, I am sure some would rather I move out of Dayton. Please feel free to donate to my moving fund. LOL)

    Thanks for the dialogue.

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  21. David Esrati October 13, 2009 / 3:24 pm

    @T

    My dog was flung off the porch at the corner of Johnson & Perrine Streets when she was about 12 weeks old. A neighbor rescued her and brought her here. She’s happy, well adjusted, and won’t bite anyone. She’s a golden retriever. I love dogs, but, believe me, the guy who tossed her off the porch, shouldn’t be allowed to either have pets or children, but- that’s not within my powers.

    Unfortunately, Dayton has no provision for write ins. Not voting in the Mayoral race is always an option.

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  22. T October 14, 2009 / 8:06 am
    David,

    I, too, had a rescue who was thrown out a 2 story window, through the glass. She was 2 months old at the time, and her crime was not being housetrained. She is in a home with responsible compassionate people now and is doing well. I am in total agreement with you on limiting who has dogs. I am avidly against the breeding of dogs, until they are all rescued. And this lefty believes that we need to control the human population with education that precedes the potential for pregnancy. Not everyone should have a kid, either, and our legal system puts many who are serverely abused right back in the hands of the “parents”.

    There is no doubt that the human population (at least the American one), is filled with people who we have not given the opportunity for education, who grow up being taught that violence is a coping mechanism, and who we have instilled no sense of social or personal responsibility in. We are about to learn the lessons of Rome, but the greedy don’t see the flood coming. They have their eyes closed too tightly trying to shut out reality and wishing for the dream to just go on. They don’t get that, while they dream, the rest of us are in a nightmare.

    How does any of that tie to the Dayton Mayoral race? It all comes down to individual behavior and responsibility. If our citizens acted like responsible citizens, dogs wouldn’t be tossed out of windows or left to freeze to death on chains. You have no idea how many people shake their heads sadly when told of the realities of dog abuse but who will do not one single thing to help. Those same people are doing nothing to pitch in to help with any other problem. Community service should be a requirement in every city, for every individual, for the duration of life.

    My vote has to go for Rhine McGlin, because she gave the right answer to the BSL question, and, unless she’s an Academy Award winner, she was entirely sincere. Leitzell, as I have stated, is not only full of himself, he has an agenda that will dictate his decisions and has nothing to do with what citizens want or will decide they want, once he has the job. If you want to see Dayton’s dogs protected from people tossing them out windows, Leitzell is not your guy. He has never had a dog, clearly has no clue about them, and that means he has no clue about how backyard breeding thugs connect to this city’s criminal activity. I also heard little to convince me that he has the experience to do the job. A woman I met at the dog park last night works for the city and pointed out how difficult it is to accomplish anything when you know the ropes. Leitzell is pretty much clueless in that category, as well, from what I heard. What Leitzell offers is arrogance and the ability to articulate. He doesn’t even have his kid in DPS. How does that work? You want to be Mayor and not support local schools? (I loathe DPS, by the way, and I wouldn’t move here with a kid because of it. I’ve tutored too many kids from that system who are 2 grade levels behind whose descriptions of classroom experiences leave me wondering how there are not multiple lawsuits pending against them.)

    It will be interesting to see if Mr. Leitzell decides to chime in and defend himself again. My plan is to support the alternate candidate for the council and hope he will bring some new ideas and energy to a group that clearly needs it. (Thought he was arrogant, too, and I suspect he is a bit too Right Wing for my taste, but he’s a far better choice than Leitzell, and that will potentially shift the balance.)

    T

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  23. David Esrati October 14, 2009 / 9:34 am

    @T

    That “alternate candidate for council” that you describe as an “arrogant right winger” is me.

    Rhine McLin surely knows the ropes- they’re the ones that have strangled this city for years- with special interests, back room deals, politics as usual. McLin wouldn’t have been elected to anything if her Daddy wasn’t C.J. McLin- and don’t ever forget that.

    There are no “qualifications” for the job of Commissioner other than being a voting resident and winning an election. Luckily, the mayor is only one vote of five- and the real power is supposed to be held by the City Manager. McLin won’t get out of the way to let the manager do his thing- Leitzell will- if only because he’ll be outvoted. The only way change will occur is if we vote her out- or install term limits – which I believe are the ultimate insult to voters intelligence.

     

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  24. T October 14, 2009 / 1:46 pm
    David,

    Well, then, you know how you came across to at least on member of the audience. Consider yourself informed. Where do you stand on the issue I obviously care most about (BSL and support of anti-chaining ordinances, for a start)?

    Obviously, the city can do only so much to impact the treatment of companion animals, as they must align their own laws within the boundaries of OH’s poor excuse for protective legislation and penalties that reflect the crime committed (not only against the animals, but against the moral fiber of our species). Nonetheless, I want someone who has a clue about what to do to address the issues and make as big of a positive impact as possible or who is willing to listen to ideas of experts who do. Is that you? I do not believe for a moment that it is Mr. Leitzell, and, if what you claim about Rhine McGlin is true, than November is a sad month for Dayton. Perhaps he will gain some political saavy in the short time before the election and figure out how to address this issue with some facts behind him and in a way that will appease a significant block of voters.

    I recognize this is only local politics, but you gotta have thick skin to do the job well. I am not insulting anyone, I don’t think. Arrogance is not something you are born with; it is a characteristic defined by behavior, including demeanor. You attacked the current administration in a cocky way (in my opinion), and that is why I said you were arrogant. It was nothing personal, and I recognize that my perception enters significantly into the equation. Maybe you were just striving to be remembered, and what politician doesn’t need that? I try not to let first impressions be lasting, when facts give me a reason to make a change.

    The intelligent debate is appreciated, and this is nothing personal to me, although I realize that much more is at stake for you. Something you might want to consider in trying to appeal to the widest Dayton audience: the majority of people I speak to who live here, and in nearby places, joke (in a cynical, dark way, not really finding it funny) about the thug-culture that exists here. That is what politicians need to figure out how to fix. Seems to me you can either try to attract people with more $$$ or help the ones who are here to change and become productive citizens.

    I would be very interested to hear your comments on that problem. Thugs are directly tied to the dogs they chain in their backyards, beat with baseball bats and leather belts, etc. (The Cincy cop who was with Gary at that meeting can tell you that tale far better than I, and you may already be well aware.) They breed dogs who turn into tortured creatures making our public unsafe and reinforcing fear-based images fed to the masses by the media. Although I realize it is hardly your first priority, it is clearly mine, so I would be interested to know what you and Mr. Leitzell will do to directly address the problem I just described, both by doing everything the city can do and reaching out to county and state level authorities.

    If I insulted you with the arrogant remark, I apologize and did not mean to get personal, but that was my honest perception. Again, just something to consider: I may not have been alone in my impression, and some people vote solely on that, (although people coming out to participate there are unlikely to be in that category, I suppose).  I was certainly willing to overlook it in both cases. Nonetheless, I am going to be a one-issue voter, no matter how wrong anyone else thinks it is. I put my life into rescuing dogs, and so do a significant number of others who get little, if anything, in return financially (and never enough to cover even half of the costs involved). We do it for other reasons, mostly ethics (except for the imbalanced, who have emotional reasons that soak up the resources of the rest of us, but that’s another long story, not for here).

    Thanks for your time. I know you have to be busy trying to win an election.

    T

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  25. David Esrati October 14, 2009 / 2:36 pm

    @T

    Briefly- arrogance and confidence are in the eye of the beholder. I used to jump out of airplanes for a living- I’ve done things that others couldn’t, wouldn’t and dare not- including run 6 times against a political machine that has no problem belittling anyone who dares to run against it. I had my windows shot out 2 nights in a row for running against Clay Dixon many years ago, I got death threats and was assaulted by a union leader and the mayor. Trust me- I have a thick skin, and I’m not naive to how I may sound. I’m not running in a popularity contest or a beauty pageant. It’s the power of ideas- not the power behind the people that concerns me- unlike my opposition.

    As to BSL – I have already answered that question- it’s horsehocky. As to viscous dog ordinances- bring them on. Also- you chain a dog- you hit it with a ball bat- we should be able to do the same to you.

    I don’t make false claims against McLin (correct spelling) – I posted both her’s and Nan’s campaign finance reports. They are on this site. You can look for yourself and decide if you want the best politicians money can buy. I won’t ever match them with money- so I have to count on talking to people truthfully and with force. This isn’t for the meek.

    Gary is naive- but, not untested. He’s been a progressive thinker in his neighborhood- trying to enact a TIF to for his neighborhood for instance. He’s been fighting the good fight for at least 10 years. He was brave enough to run against someone considered “unbeatable”- for that, I give him credit.

    As a dog lover- especially of abused dogs- you should be backing the underdog in this race. He can’t do any more damage than she’ll do.

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  26. Ice Bandit June 5, 2010 / 12:57 pm
    The Old Bandito has watched rival bikers brawl. Once provoked, they use chains, chairs, fists, two by fours or whatever is handy. Despite the savagery, these altercations tend to be stand-up fights that are over once the last punch is thrown. When rival factions of Democrats mix it up, they use lawyers, innuendo, back-stabbing, and their toadies in the media. Furthermore they are still pissed at each other 20 years later. When it comes to the throw-down, the Old Bandito prefers bikers to Democrats any day…..

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