Comments on: City Commission wants to raise your taxes as an Emergency!

By: Will Brooks

Will Brooks — Wed, 17 Feb 2010 17:14:28 +0000

@Jstults – I could stand to clarify part of my rhetorical question you quoted. In this case, it refers to the efforts people are making to change things for the better. Continuous improvement is always desirable but I wasn’t inferring that in this case. I should have been more clear. Also, from Mayor Leitzell’s post, I get the picture that City Hall isn’t a bunch of corrupt idiots but may be comprised of people who care but have lacked effective leadership at times. I would say that Mayor Leitzell is off to a good start if he can keep things moving in the direction we appear to be headed.

Having been successful in leadership/management for over 10 years my perception is that unless we at Esrati.com can get to the place that we lavish praise where it is due then this forum will be discounted as a haven for armchair critics who wish to say what should, would, and could, be done. Personally, I think better of David Esrati and his works here.

And your welcome, I think we are saying the same things.

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By: jstults

jstults — Wed, 17 Feb 2010 17:00:04 +0000

Will Brooks:

Is it ever good enough?

No. Continuous improvement doesn’t happen by itself. Meat-sacks like us need ‘motivation’ and critical feed-back. Nothing personal, it’s just [Politics / Business / etc.].

Having said that, part of motivation consists of praising improvement (so thanks WB for doing that).

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By: Will Brooks

Will Brooks — Wed, 17 Feb 2010 16:10:39 +0000

@ David E. – You have some good points and no doubt some of these should be implemented. But none of the changes that Gary campaigned on are going to happen quickly. Hell, having changes in the city charter coming up for a vote, minutes and agendas available, and the Mayor coming over here to respond is significant enough. Why the need to be so aggressive and outspoken? Is it ever good enough? You really believe you would be able to step in there and make it all right?

I’m not attacking you just throwing the other side of the picture into view.

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By: Hall

Hall — Wed, 17 Feb 2010 15:31:14 +0000

Those 166 pages were probably compiled from multiple departments over a period of several days or weeks leading up to the meeting. It’s NEVER as easy as click-and-print to do a project like that!

I didn’t look through the entire 160+ page document to see if any of it’s handwritten, typed (typewriter), or what, but copy-and-pasting is easy to make all of the different ones into one ‘master’ document. There’s no excuse…

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By: David Esrati

David Esrati — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 23:15:00 +0000

@Gary- thanks for acknowledging that charter amendments should have been presented earlier- that these weren’t something that just came up yesterday.

I use the headline to get attention- because I don’t have the platform that you have- with TV coverage and newspaper stories. You have the pulpit- I’m down in the trenches, and I say it’s time to show more professional management- planning for these things, avoiding the emergency when there clearly was none.

As to researching the legalese- I’m not a lawyer- and this isn’t written in plain English. In fact- I’d have rejected this language as obtuse- and worked to use English people can understand.

Face it- this isn’t how people speak:

Out of said total maximum levy, an amount shall annually be levied sufficient to pay the interest, sinking fund and retirement charges on all bonds and notes of the City of Dayton heretofore or hereafter authorized to be issued without the authority of the electors, which levy shall be placed before and in preference to all other levies and for the full amount thereof. Of the remaining portion of said total maximum levy, an amount not exceeding five mills may be levied annually for the general fund of said city.

We have to be able to do better than this.

Also- the points about how it is presented- including ADA compliance aren’t to be ignored. Just getting the stuff posted is one thing- making it meet legal requirements (of which the posting is one) is the rest of the requirement.

I hope we see a change- both because it’s the right thing to do- and it’s also easier.

Get some IT people working in City Hall who understand how to use Wiki’s- and file sharing- and Darwin Information Typing Architecture – to cut the amount of paperwork involved in changing and updating all these regs.

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By: Will Brooks

Will Brooks — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 17:05:37 +0000

@ Mayor Leitzell – Thanks for the explanation. Transparency, in this case, has significantly decreased my disgust level and built a layer of empathy into my psyche towards the City Commission. Thanks again.

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By: Drexel Dave Sparks

Drexel Dave Sparks — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 16:56:48 +0000

So, is the city commission voting to raise taxes, or isn’t it?
Some simplification would go a lomg way.

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By: jstults

jstults — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 15:40:22 +0000

CSAPT:

Those 166 pages were probably compiled from multiple departments over a period of several days or weeks leading up to the meeting. It’s NEVER as easy as click-and-print to do a project like that!

Sure, I understand there’s going to be some work-flow inefficiency if you are scanning documents from outside organizations (though if they are scanned and OCR’d and concactenated into a single document in a good piece of software, then it does become click and print, and the work-load is lowered on the person doing the project). If they are from other departments in the same city government, then there’s no need for them to go to print and then back to electronic through the ‘analog hole’, that’s just waste (even signatures can be done electronically these days).

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By: Gary Leitzell

Gary Leitzell — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 15:00:43 +0000

OK. Let me chime in here. These charter amendments have to be filed with the board of elections something like 75 days before an election in order for them to be on the ballot. If these are not passed as emergencies they will miss the deadline. Hence, in this case, time is of the essence. That being said, in order for these to follow normal procedure, they would have to have been presented to the commission in early January. David is correct when he emphasizes that proper planning would prevent much of the perception of back room deals going on.
This truly is a first step and quite a big one considering. The fact that this information is being made available before it goes in front of the commission allows for public scrutiny and will probably reduce the amount of emergency ordinances and resolutions being presented in the future. There are more changes to the charter on the horizon. Maybe we can get those to be processed through normal procedure so that they appear on the November ballot without having to be presented as emergencies.
@ David,
We are not passing an ordinance to raise taxes that doesn’t already exist. We are updating the charter to be in line with the 21st century. The text below was copied and pasted from the city charter which is available from the city website (but you have to find it). It reflects the text that is being replaced by the proposed legislation. The old text is from 1945.
If you take the time to read the charter sections that the new text replaces, you would see that the new wording makes complete sense. Keep doing what you do. You may want to be a little more diligent with your research though before you go into attack mode because I am going to hold your feet to the fire just as you are trying to do to me!
SUPPLEMENTS
Limitation of the Total Tax Rate Which May Be Levied Without a
Vote of the People for All the Purposes of the Municipality § 171.
The City Commission is hereby granted the authority, without a
vote of the people, to levy taxes upon the tax lists or duplicates
of property assessed and listed for taxation according to value
for all the purposes of the City of Dayton, its boards,
departments and institutions, in amounts not in excess of the
following total maximum levies for the years specified, to wit:
Eight and one-half mills on each dollar of assessed valuation
on the tax list or duplicate for the years l945 to l950, both
inclusive (for the purposes of the fiscal years l946 to l951, both
inclusive);
Nine mills on each dollar of assessed valuation on the tax
list or duplicate for the years l951 and l952 (for the purposes of
the fiscal years l952 and l953);
Ten mills on each dollar of assessed valuation on the tax
list or duplicate for the year l953 and all years thereafter (for
the purposes of the fiscal year l954 and all years thereafter).
Out of said total maximum levy for each of said years, an
amount shall annually be levied sufficient to pay the interest,
sinking fund and retirement charges on all bonds and notes of the
City of Dayton heretofore or hereafter authorized to be issued
48
without the authority of the electors, which levy shall be placed
before and in preference to all other levies and for the full
amount thereof. Of the remaining portion of said total maximum
levy, commencing with the levy against the tax list or duplicate
for the year l945 and continuing thereafter, an amount not
exceeding 5 mills may be levied annually for the general fund of
said city.
The City Commission, without a vote of the people, may not
authorize any tax levy or levies for permanent improvements other
than those which may be made within the 5 mills levy for the
general fund, as set forth in the fifth paragraph of this section,
if such levy or levies will increase the total levies for all city
purposes, inclusive of all levies to pay the interest, sinking
fund and retirement charges on all unvoted bonds and notes of the
City of Dayton and those voted bonds heretofore or hereafter
issued pursuant to vote of the electors at any election held prior
to November 16, l945, beyond 8-l/2 mills for the tax years l945 to
l950, 9 mills for the tax years l951-l952, and 10 mills for the
tax year l953 and all years thereafter.
Unless authorized and approved by a vote of the electors
conformably with the general laws of this state, the City
Commission shall levy no tax outside of the limitations set forth
in this section. Provided, however, that the City Commission
shall annually levy, to the extent necessary, outside the
limitations provided in this Charter and by general law a
sufficient sum to pay the interest, sinking fund and retirement
charges on all bonds and notes of the City of Dayton heretofore or
hereafter lawfully issued, the tax for which by general law or by
this Charter has been or shall be authorized to be levied outside
of tax limitations.
This section shall take effect and be in force as of the date
of the certification to the Secretary of State by the Board of
Elections, for the purpose of fixing the tax rate upon the tax
list or duplicate for the year l945 and all years thereafter.
(Adopted by voters, ll-6-45)

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By: David Esrati

David Esrati — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 11:51:18 +0000

@CSAPT you can’t defend ballot issues as emergencies- unless there is a crisis that just came up. These issues aren’t new, they aren’t a surprise- they should have lots of discussion and a presentation about each should be available somewhere to explain them to the public- maybe using Slideshare and Powerpoint.

The only reason they are being passed as an emergency is because either you don’t want the public to have input- or time to dig into the issue, or because staff wasn’t doing their job and put things off till the last minute.

Every time you make excuses for the “misnomer” you just come off as a company man who refuses to question our emperor who has no clothes.

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By: Shortwest Rick

Shortwest Rick — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 05:46:30 +0000

What’s scary David is the City Commission has had 355 days to act on the DOJ thing and sat on their hands until it became an emergency to get it on the May 4 ballot. Setting aside the influence of our current and previous mayors who only have/had one vote each, what’s up with the other four Commisioners?

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By: Civil Servants Are People, Too

Civil Servants Are People, Too — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 05:26:22 +0000

Again, the term “emergency” is a misnomer. It is generally not a true emergency, but an expedient way to get things done in an environment of shrinking resources that still requires mounds of paperwork. It is used by the State and in cities all over Ohio. They should really just change the name and call them “immediately effective” ordinances.

Here’s Dayton’s code:

Sec. 42. Emergency Measures.
All ordinances and resolutions shall be in effect from and after 30 days from the date of their passage by the Commission, except as otherwise provided in this Charter. The Commission may, by an affirmative vote of not less than four members, pass emergency measures to take effect at the time indicated therein. An emergency measure is an ordinance or resolution for the immediate preservation of the public peace, property, health or safety, or providing for the usual daily operation of a municipal department, in which the emergency is set forth and defined in a preamble thereto. LINK

For another example, here is the City of Oxford’s municipal code, which basically says the same thing.    LINK Search for Beavercreek, Cincinnati or wherever, and you will find it everywhere.

@Twin Towers - A CRA is a property tax exemption used to encourage development in a specified neighborhood.      LINK

@JS…    Those 166 pages were probably compiled from multiple departments over a period of several days or weeks leading up to the meeting.   It’s NEVER as easy as click-and-print to do a project like that!

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By: David Esrati

David Esrati — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 05:11:02 +0000

You know what’s even more interesting- if they posted this stuff legally- with time for review- and, with commenting ability- like I do here, they might get some amazing insight from the citizens they are supposed to be representing.

Thanks for catching what I didn’t have time to.

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By: Shortwest Rick

Shortwest Rick — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 04:30:21 +0000

I suspect the verbage regarding competetive and noncompetetive classes of employment is intended to allow the City to hire police officers relevent to DOJ requirements. It seems to be almost a copy and paste from another city’s charter and boiled down to fit the circumstances…

http://dallascityhall.com/civil_service/civil_service_rules3.html

Hahaha!!! the Tecksas influence abounds…

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By: jstults

jstults — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 04:24:11 +0000

Here’s a google map of the red light cameras to which they want to add speed enforcement, from the OCR’d version:

Attached is an Ordinance which would add speed enforcement to the automated traffic control
photographic system which currently monitors for red-light violations only. It is believed to be in
the City of Dayton and the citizens’ best interests and should significantly reduce the number of
speeding violations and thereby reduce accidents.
The Department has also advised additional traffic accident and speed studies be conducted which
could augment and update the existing data from Ohio State Patrol and the Ohio Department of
Public Safety. The Department of Police with some guidance from Civil Engineering will be doing
such studies in the coming weeks.
The attached map and list provide the current locations of the automated traffic control sites, which
are probable future speed enforcement locations. Once studies have been completed the final
determination of sites will be made public, as well as the thirty-day warning period.
The Law Department has written and approved the new ordinance as to form and correctness

This could be a good revenue generator (as long as they are more efficient at sending out automated tickets than they are at uploading the meeting agenda; sorry, couldn’t resist).

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By: jstults

jstults — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 03:46:27 +0000

Another bad thing about just images rather than text + images is that the file is much larger than it needs to be; pdfs can be very small and nice looking if used properly. This isn’t just nerdy complaining either (stop laughing at me), that’s a significant unnecessary load on the city’s servers. Also, someone had to type that thing up in the first place, then print it, then scan it, then upload it, wtf kind of work-flow is that? Government efficiency at its finest. Generate the pdf directly from your word processing program. If you can’t do that then either you or the program is broken, get a new one (person or program). Then we’d get a small, search-able, hyper-linked file, less work for whoever had to type/print/scan/upload, and useful meta-data instead of:

Title: None
Subject: None
Author: None
Keywords: None
Producer: Xerox 4112
Creator: Xerox 4112
Created: Fri 12 Feb 2010 04:56:53 PM EST
Modified: Mon 15 Feb 2010 03:12:19 PM EST
Format: PDF-1.6
Number of Pages: 161
Optimized: No
Security: No

If this was a last-minute ‘heroic effort’ to get anything up at all, then I applaud the hero, hopefully a more sane process will make heroism like that unnecessary in the future.

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By: David Esrati

David Esrati — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 03:33:14 +0000

@truddick you’ll have exactly 3 minutes to make your case on Wednesday night to debate the pros and cons of each issue- as opposed to the standard way which would have given at least 2 readings in successive weeks.

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By: truddick

truddick — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 03:30:29 +0000

Perhaps the pros and cons of each issue should be debated instead of assembling a laundry list and declaring it all in need of stain removal?

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By: Will Brooks

Will Brooks — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 03:16:24 +0000

My God, what a blatant way to circumvent the policies that should govern them. This is what happens with an apathetic populace. I’m just disgusted.

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